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| Spokane area help http://4g61t.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=40134 |
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| Author: | Incoltnito [ Thu Apr 30, 2015 4:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Spokane area help |
I'm in town for a short stint. Think that I may have installed a bunk 14b...won't spool...everything worked great before the install, nothing has changed. Anybody local have a spare 14b laying around that I could try swapping out? |
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| Author: | Shawn J [ Sat May 02, 2015 6:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spokane area help |
I don't have any spares. Maybe it's just the wg flapper not blocking the hole. Try playing with the actuator arm and see if the flapper moves freely and seats correctly. |
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| Author: | Incoltnito [ Sat May 02, 2015 9:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spokane area help |
Quote: I don't have any spares. Maybe it's just the wg flapper not blocking the hole. Try playing with the actuator arm and see if the flapper moves freely and seats correctly.
Maybe simply disconnect the arm from the flapper and check to see if it sits differently than the arms natural length allows, is your advice, right? The flapper moved freely, I noticed, when I had the o2 housing off, so we will discount that from the list. Boost leak test was completely tight at 10-30psi. Wish I had the vacuum tool to eliminate the bov for any reason.On a side note, I once propped open the wastegate on my old mirage with a 11b turbo....I couldn't spool that little turbo even if I stuck a half stick of dynomite in the fuel tank! Would it be safe to assume that the wastegate flapper even slightly not seated could kill the spool mostly? I get a little rush in 2nd gear and hit 6psi above 4,500rpm, every gear is the same situation and it literally needs to be up around 5k rpm to spool. |
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| Author: | Flying Eagle [ Sun May 03, 2015 10:01 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spokane area help |
The flapper can be moved inboard/outboard )as opposed to rotating it open/closed) and give erratic boost levels as a result. I had this happen on the 14b that was on my car. Once removed I could see it was really obvious. That is what Shawn was eluding to. Also, the seat area and not just the main collector inlet for exhaust gases, are the two main zones where the carbon pulls from the casting and you get deep fissures. You would have seen this before installing the turbo, but with the flapper in the proper place, many people have gotten decent boost and never realized there was an issue, while others get low if nothing on the gauge. All depends upon how much is not sealed in and blows by the flapper. |
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| Author: | Incoltnito [ Sun May 03, 2015 12:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spokane area help |
Quote: The flapper can be moved inboard/outboard )as opposed to rotating it open/closed) and give erratic boost levels as a result. I had this happen on the 14b that was on my car. Once removed I could see it was really obvious. That is what Shawn was eluding to.
I visually inspected for any cracks inside the turbine passage & around the flapper port, had even connected the wastegate arm to the flapper while the o2 housing was removed to check for flush contact. Just for trying, I removed the arm from the flapper last night. I confirm it is being held flush naturally.Also, the seat area and not just the main collector inlet for exhaust gases, are the two main zones where the carbon pulls from the casting and you get deep fissures. You would have seen this before installing the turbo, but with the flapper in the proper place, many people have gotten decent boost and never realized there was an issue, while others get low if nothing on the gauge. All depends upon how much is not sealed in and blows by the flapper. Keep thinking the spool is going right back into the air tract to indicate a problem with the BOV somehow seizing open....but again, a boost leak test (without vacuum testing the bov) should have ruled it out? Pretty hilarious, really. 14b and the tires won't break loose in 1rst gear. :^/ |
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| Author: | Flying Eagle [ Sun May 03, 2015 5:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spokane area help |
The dud recirc valve I got years ago, would test fine to 15 PSI and then open, when using a vacuum/pressure pump. That said, using a hand held pump does not test it "enough" to simulate what happens inside the pressure tract. That valve when installed would cause the compressor to surge, meaning it would not vent nearly at all, and my turbo was making the duck call/flutter noise pretty badly. Remove the and plug the vacuum line to the recirc valve and see what happens. You want to hear compressor surge. |
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| Author: | Shawn J [ Sun May 03, 2015 7:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spokane area help |
Yes. I have also seen the wg flapper become so loose on the wg arm inside the housing that it can allow the flapper to tilt so much that the side of the flapper actually catches on the wg hole itself and not let the flapper seal the hole. Just a general overall inspection of the flapper movement with the wg actuator disconnected from it should eliminate it entirely. |
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| Author: | Incoltnito [ Thu May 07, 2015 11:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spokane area help |
Thanks Shawn & Tim! Sorry for the late response, I had to get away for a couple days to get lost in the mountains. I took your suggestions into consideration. I am not hearing any turbo surge or even pressurized air, revving up high in neutral. Never had a turbo NOT make any noise revving in neutral...it's just like the WG flapper is wide open, but it isn't, so confused. Maybe just buy a new out of the box turbo and have it sent here before my next hometime??? Who knows what is happening...journal bearing seizing, mysterious wg flapper. A family member suggested that I buy a rebuild kit. If that turbo is coming off, I'm sorry, there will be a different one going in to replace it. $50 for a rebuild (on a said good turbo) doesn't sound bad to the average guy, but the average guy isn't away from home as often. |
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| Author: | Shawn J [ Sat May 09, 2015 6:03 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spokane area help |
I have seen one more thing but it is such an odd occurrence I forgot all about it. A friend of mine had a high mileage, high abuse 14b that stopped making boost. It ran fine, didn't burn oil or smoke, it just had no power. The compressor wheel would spin freely and didn't look terrible at all. The flapper tested fine and everything. It wasn't until he finally took the turbo off that we noticed there was no turbine wheel at all. Haha. It was gone, sheared off. Then looking closer at the downpipe we saw a pattern of small dents from the inside out where the t-wheel made its way down the pipe probably spinning at 150,000rpm. I think it ultimately ended up lodged inside the muffler as it wasn't a straight through design. It's funny that the turbo shaft must have had enough of a burr on it to hold it in place and not fall out once the wheel sheared off. But inspecting the turbo from the compressor side it looked and felt like a normal high mileage operable unit. Lol |
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| Author: | Incoltnito [ Sat May 09, 2015 3:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spokane area help |
Thanks for sharing that story...completely hilarious! Hey...there's no turbine wheel here!!! Lol |
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| Author: | Flying Eagle [ Sat May 09, 2015 5:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spokane area help |
Have you spun the turbine blades by hand? Used compressed air from a nozzle to spin it up, even if momentarily? If you confirm it is spinning, then you can try for compressor surge. |
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