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Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
http://4g61t.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=38031		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  PIG61t [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 12:37 am ]
Post subject:  Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
Hey team. Been watching some Initial D lately and yes, I know its a cartoon but the fact that an N/A car revving to 10,000-11,000 RPM is pretty impressive. So my question is this, should i upgrade the headers and gut the exhaust with some lumpy HKS cams and tune her up in my 4G61 DOHC 16 valve motor which has around 125,000kms on the clock OR spool up with a snail (Td05) from my old 1989 VR-4?
Author:  Broke4speed [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 7:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
Without SERIOUS attention to the valvetrain, you're not going to be able to rev any higher than you would with a bit of boost.

Unless you want all the RPM noise without the nasty side effect of horsepower ;).
Author:  CSM Shaun [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
Good news! For a high-revving 4G6X your best bet is the 4G61 due to the miniscule 75mm stroke. As already stated, you will need an upgraded valvetrain in addition to a camshaft set that is capable of producing meaningful power at those RPMs. With over 100,000 miles on the clock do not expect such an engine to survive long. A rebuild would definitely be necessary as would upgraded pistons, fasteners and gaskets.

For cheap speed you could simply add a turbo and live with the fact that you simply do not need to rev your engine to 10,000 RPM to have a shit ton of fun. My last 4G61 went this route and it routinely saw rev-limiter at 8,000 RPM without issues. See here: viewtopic.php?f=64&t=34323
Author:  PIG61t [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 3:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
Ahh right hah, best leave the NA killer for Takumi then. Mean thread cuz, looking foward to the journey, already sussed the turbo and additional bits and bobs from and older 4g63 so hopefully it all fits like a glove :) Then gotta paint her up in a nasty Khaki colour youll find on some later model nissan maximas and pump the guards to fit some factory 4x114.3 14x9in steelies - feeling excited :D

P.S. I meant Kilometres not Miles as in NZD thats out metric system but its still quite high so a rebuild may still be necessary ;)
Author:  CSM Shaun [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 4:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
Good call. The naturally aspirated 4G61 has a turbo-friendly compression ratio of around 9:1 and can easily have oil squirters installed to help keep the pistons alive. A 16g with a few supporting mods and you will have smiles for days.
Author:  PIG61t [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 5:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
Sorry what do you mean by a 16g? Feels like your talking about the snail?
Author:  CSM Shaun [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 7:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
Yes, an Evolution III 16g turbocharger.
Author:  CaptainTonus [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
Quote:
Good call. The naturally aspirated 4G61 has a turbo-friendly compression ratio of around 9:1 and can easily have oil squirters installed to help keep the pistons alive. A 16g with a few supporting mods and you will have smiles for days.
You don't need oil squirters.
Quote:
Yes, an Evolution III 16g turbocharger.
On their side of the world they say TD05 for everything. Haha That turbo would be very laggy on the 4g61 motor, so I wouldn't recommend it if you want instant response. If you're planning to rev super high, then you'd be ok. You're still not going to get to 10,000rpm territory with it. 9,000rpm is pretty doable with just upgraded valvetrain and larger cams. At that point, you're just gonna keep blowing up transmissions because the synchros don't like shifting that high.
Author:  CSM Shaun [ Thu Aug 15, 2013 12:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
Had a 16g on my 1.6 and it wasn't laggy.

More lubrication and cooling on the pistons is a good thing. Are oil squirters needed? Maybe not, but they sure as hell do something, and it isn't a bad thing.
Author:  Broke4speed [ Thu Aug 15, 2013 12:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
I've run non-squirter motors in forced induction applications for years without issue. Now, they most definitely have a purpose, but if I had a motor that didn't come with them...I wouldn't waste my time installing them.
Author:  CaptainTonus [ Thu Aug 15, 2013 12:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
Quote:
Had a 16g on my 1.6 and it wasn't laggy.
I had a 16g on mine, and it was HORRIBLE, but the motor was also toast, so that probably didn't help
Quote:
I've run non-squirter motors in forced induction applications for years without issue. Now, they most definitely have a purpose, but if I had a motor that didn't come with them...I wouldn't waste my time installing them.
^^What he said
Author:  CSM Shaun [ Thu Aug 15, 2013 2:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
I've ran engines without them and with them. With the 4g61 installing oil-squirters is a nut-and-bolt affair so it is simple peace of mind.

Turbo lag is definitely an "opinion" kind of topic. What I consider "lag" may not be exactly what someone else considers lag.
Author:  PIG61t [ Thu Aug 15, 2013 3:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
Hmm. Well in that case what i may need to do is get my TD04 turbo (smaller VR4 snail) on the beast first, and then see what difference that is compared to the TD05. Woohoo - thanks for the thread boys!
Author:  Broke4speed [ Thu Aug 15, 2013 3:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
Simple nut-and-bolt-and-disassemble-half-the-motor affair you mean, lol.

Not debating the ease of install, just stating that there's no reason to install them if they didn't come on it already. Engines don't blow up because of lack of squirters.
Author:  slowdsm [ Thu Aug 15, 2013 3:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Naturally Aspirated v. 4G63 bolt on Turbo
Quote:
Simple nut-and-bolt-and-disassemble-half-the-motor affair you mean, lol.

Not debating the ease of install, just stating that there's no reason to install them if they didn't come on it already. Engines don't blow up because of lack of squirters.


but some do blow up with squirters... the ones that break and cause damage LOL...



Steve
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