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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 2:40 am 
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Location: Orange County California(Garden Grove)
I have high nox numbers, cleaned already but not housing into engine. I might have switched vacume lines since i think there was three, of them . Not sure if it matters if i did this wrong or not but i will try to take them off again. I had almost had the numbers on all but half passing but then it doubled for some reason when i cleaned egr valve , spark plugs and wires, and oil change and filters. Stupid things confuses me every year how to pass. Im trying to change 02 sensor but it stuck on there. wheres the cheapest best o2 sensor please, thanks..


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 4:51 am 
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try running 1 gallon of E85 with exactly 1/2 tank of reg gas.. drive it for about 20 miles to get it to mix.. it works for me every time.




Steve

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Steve 89 colt 2.3 stroker stock top end. evo3@20 psi 13.489@99.30mph 3/10 2012
On drag radials.auto trans.launching @ 5 psi and no traction thru 2nd.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 10:16 am 
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Fix those EGR vacuum hoses and remove the EGR housing and clean the intake side properly with a wire brush, small screwdrivers to chip out the chunks of oily carbon. If it is partially plugged up, your numbers will be no better but the fact that your numbers got twice as bad, tells us that your have something switched or leaking.
See the other thread where I posted the diagram of the vacuum line routing.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:15 am 
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Location: Orange County California(Garden Grove)
Ill take the egr off again tommorow and try cleaning it like you say, thanks. I did bye throttle body cleaner and some good barbicue brushes from home depot. Im pretty sure the vacume line facing the drivers tire was ok. I think i just might of switched the other two in the back or whatever. The one on the bottom you cant i believe is a special line. I baught a new o2 sensor today, tried taking it off with a stupid o2 tool and stripped the stupid nut on o2 sensor. I still need to know how do i know if my egr is working or not, and how to test it? Thanks so much Mr eagle and sorry hyper as heck so yea sorry again. Oh well i guess since you seem to answer everything and you said to stick to one post ill just say it here. How the heck will i get a slightly stripped o2 sensor off my car to put new one on? I had a idea that since the o2 tools are open they flex and cause a slip somewhat. If i were to cut the o2 wires maybe i could put a deep socket of some sort in there and take it out? What you thinks the best way? Not sure why its so tight eighther. Thanks alot, i have till the end of the month to get my stickers to save my beloved car from police impound....sucks..P. S. regular gas is 87 89 91 ? And i guess ill have to figure out where to get e85 gas at too.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:25 pm 
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Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2006 3:03 pm
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Location: Calgary, AB, Canada
To get the o2 sensor off, try a 22 mm boxed end or closed end (12 point) wrench. Just unplug the connector to get it on. Make sure that you jack the car up and use stands. The car needs to be high enough so that you can work on it from underneath, it's hard to get at the sensor from up top.

Also use penetrating oil on it. Soak it, let it sit 1/2 hour, then soak it again, keep doing that.

Hopefully u didn't completely strip the sensor. Be careful when removing these things; when baring down on the tool watch the tool to make sure its not damaging the bolt/nut head.

[Edit]

Sorry this is a turbo car. You should be able to get at the sensor from above. Don't worry about jacking up the car.

As Tim pointed out below. Are you sure it's the 02 sensor that needs to be replaced? What has lead you to believe this is what is broken?

[/Edit]

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Last edited by j2dapo on Thu Dec 27, 2012 4:15 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 2:04 pm 
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Location: Ottawa, ON, Canada
If it is completely stripped, or even partially it is going to be a bugger without fitting a removal tool like they use on lug nuts that stripped or bloat and cannot fit a socket anymore. If an 02 sensor is seized in place and you want to salvage it, you can use a MAPP (yellow tank) torch available at Home Depot/Lowes/hardware store. The propane torches don't have enough heat content, nor will they ever heat it fast enough to save the sensor.
The idea is the heat the manifold just outside of the threads for the sensor and do it in a fast circular fashion , and then with a good 02 socket and ratchet, shock the handle (like a hit from a hammer or your hands), an adapter to half inch and a breaker bar attached can work wonders when you want a small movement to create a big effort on a stuck fastener but you can also do more damage than good if you overdo this theory; small fasteners and red hot parts can equal breakage. If you do not care about the sensor or think it can be saved, this should probably work either way. The problem you may have now is that likely you will have to cut the sensor short to fit a better fitting socket and or removal tool and thus the 02 will not be reusable. If the sensor threads are too seized, as they are removed they could "gall" the mating threads on the manifold. Then you have to buy a thread chaser and hope there is enough left to reinstall a new sensor to.
You can see why pulling the 02 sensor is a last resort here.

I highly suspect your 02 is likely fine, and you have other issues at hand first, especially considering how bad your emissions got with only touching the EGR setup and the likelyhood that vacuum lines are switched.

To test your EGR, we've told you before you can use a wide flat tip screwdriver to move the diaphragm or use a vacuum pump tool (cheap) while the engine is running, the more it moves, the more it should be opening and the more the engine should drop RPM and almost/will stall. If nothing happens, then you likely have a plugged EGR passageway or a blown diaphragm and it is not opening with direct vacuum applied. I highly suggest the vacuum pump like these:
Click me for pic of vacuum pump from MityVac


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 10:33 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2008 10:20 pm
Posts: 167
Location: Orange County California(Garden Grove)
Hey guys, thanks so much for the help i really appriciate all the ideas and help here. I try to use this sight and these quiestions for years to come to help me keep these cars. Sorry Eagle i do my best to pay attention. Im not very good with cars like you are and i have some kinda hyper activity thingy too so that makes it harder to focus and get things done. Anyways i finally got the o2 sensor off, went to a shop and after two days of soaking the crap out of it with pb blast and w'd we used the ideas you said and also used a air gun and special socket things and just destroyed the old o2. Put a new one and it seems to idle better, slight up and down. Now tommorow i am going to check and then clean the egr and the throttle body after 10 hours of work. Then i will be going to trying to smog it for the sixth time. If this doesnt pass then i will be forced to pay illigally once again,sucks. Thanks again to you all.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 9:33 pm 
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Make sure you have a clean gasket surface and a new EGR gasket installed after cleaning that area.
That will help make sure there are no leaks from what you have removed and reinstalled.
We'd like to see your car pass legally and in one shot, but these cars can have a mind on there own when they get older and things get well "used".


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 12:52 am 
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Location: Orange County California(Garden Grove)
[/bK thanks, Eagle. I didnt get to it today, worked ten hours and tired. I have time tommorow after work only 8 hours. You mean the little metal gasket? its gotta be impossible to find one of those new. Usually the dealer doesnt have much left even.. I will try to clean and pass this thing tommorow. Seams to be running better with o2 sensor installed but still flucuates at idle.. I saw online on utube you clean your egr valve and housing then leave it off and start car and it blows all that crap out instead of going down into engine and stuff, is this a good idea you think.. Last chance for legal smog, hope it works cause i can use that money to gamble in vegas this weekend for new years....haha. ]


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 9:41 am 
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Okay, we'll there are tons of kits from FelPro that have that gasket inside. Any car that has a head gasket kit should have that gasket inside but more than likely aftermarket parts like TopLine and the other rebuilder parts company will have it. Call around and get it or get some high temp RTV and put a thin coat on either side of the gasket and let it cure after install before startup. I cannot see starting the engine with the EGR off as doing anything because it is mainly vacuum that is seen in that tube running into the intake. Better off using a blow gun down the spark plug holes to blow any cleaner back into the intake manifold, and try to dry it out as much as possible before starting and allowing it to pass by your new o2 sensor. Do this while the EGR is off the manifold and any extra carbon will come out too.

I figure it better to bet on a sure thing, than it is to go up against the house. You need your car, money better spent IMHO.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 9:35 pm 
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Location: Orange County California(Garden Grove)
Hey guys i have had my throttle body off cleaning and egr and housing too. The egr housing was nasty gross but is great now. I used a wire brush that fit pirfect from home depot, got it in the barbicueing section. I have pictures of this but not sure how to put any on here. I sprayed carb cleaner up in the little housing holes and all the carbon came rushing back out so that was a bonus. I also tried cleaning the intake mannifold it had alot of nasty carbon and also sticky and gooey crap in the little passage on the edge where the throttle attaches theeres little hole that goes down to mannifold. Anyways is it ok if i sprayed and scrape the mannifold? Where does all the crap go down into the engine,is that ok for it. I will try to buy a blow gun tommorow at harbor freight and i guess blow the crap back out from individual spart plug holes i guess. Wonder if it would work to blow the crap threw the mannifold and egr passage ways out the spark plug hole too. Today was rainy and crappy so i left my car in the lawn from last night without doing anything but sleeping and eating and watching clippers game now,haha. Thanks, nIght. Charlie.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 1:02 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2008 10:20 pm
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Location: Orange County California(Garden Grove)
Hey guys Ive had issues passing smog tonights my last night on the street for car. I had tried to pass smog but couldnt, numbers were close after all this but nox and some other. Anyways i took of egr and throttle body and tried to clean egr well and the housing too. Got a nice brush to go in the housing and sprayed it with carberator cleaner inside the egr housing and down the little hole in intake manifold. The intake mannifold had nasty gunk in it so i sprayed some cleaners in there and tried to wipe most away. I think alot went down into the mannifold ports to wherever i dont know though. I put it all back and went to start it but now it's worse. It sounds like a subaru and bogs down. Sounds like when my eclipse got suger in the tank before. I checked all the spark plugs and seem ok but dont really know if there ok or not, seem clean enough although all the cleaner might of messed them up huh? I compression check all cylanders and all are within few of eachother at 148 or so. Im getting alot of stumbling and subaru sound at low end revs. Seems to do much better not under low gear loads or better in third fourth when i dont press it much. Sucks , i dont know what to do with this dang car now i cant drive on street anymore and i need a sticker for smog... Sucks, please help...


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 6:52 am 
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Joined: Thu May 05, 2005 2:31 am
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Location: Commerce City, Co
The car is is not running on all four cylinders. You likely fouled the number four spark plug when you sprayed the cleaner in the egr hole. You can use a wire brush/wire wheel on a bench grinder and some brake cleaner and clean the spark plug. Or you could sand blast the spark plug. Or, if you don't have access to all those tools, just swap in some new spark plugs and it will likely return to running on all four cylinders. Have you verified that you have spark on all four cylinders still? Like maybe somehow you damaged the cam angle sensor while working on the car.

All you need to check spark is to pull all the spark plug wires out of the spark plug holes. Grab a philips screwdriver and stick it all the way in the end of the spark plug wire. Then put the shaft of the screwdriver close to one of the studs/bolts for the struts for the suspension. You are essentially grounding out the screwdriver. You will see the spark jump to the chassis once you have someone stick the key in the ignition and turn the car over. Or you could do one at a time if you pull the connector for the injector resistor pack.

My guess is you fouled at least on spark plug.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 9:49 am 
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Location: Ottawa, ON, Canada
^^^ Do what he says.

If by chance the EGR port is not sealed, start the engine and put your hand down there and feel for escaping exhaust gases.

I'm combining this thread with your other one. Remember the part about using one thread?


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 4:06 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2008 10:20 pm
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Location: Orange County California(Garden Grove)
Hey guys, thanks for help. Eagle i put a new one cause i had a few different new issues with the car and they require quick responses. I will go an buy new iridium plugs again today. Just baught those ones though i should of taken them out to clean car. I can just take off my spark plugs when cars running and hold the spark plug wire and touch it too the metal parts to see if there sparking right? Also the egr trick to see if its working or not im not sure how to test that. I wonder if a bad egr would make the car sputter like this, it sounds like it has moments of wanting to go. (Remember i have little to no boost or power) would this be because of the care missfiring or not running on all cylanders. Also could it be that its a clogged catalytic converter? Dang i just remember i have new plugs in my red car with pile of extra parts,great. Ill try changing plugs and then i will try taking cat completely off, also will check spark but not sure why spark would be effected by cleaning egr and throttle body and mannifold. Im thinking egr's not working or somethings clogged though. Thanks so much guys im off to go test some stuff. CharleyTurbo..


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