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PostPosted: Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:07 pm 
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Spends Too Much Time Under The Hood
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Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 9:43 pm
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Location: Cape May Court House, NJ
I've searched for hours and hours on what else will fit the C10 bodystyle as far as springs/struts go. I've looked in the Chilton's 81-88 import service manual, which I have in my possession, and several online sources and retailers..

In other countries obviously there were many strut and spring options for our cars including performance variants. I'm looking for a performance strut and spring combo. There's none left that will fit the C10 Colt on this continent and noone's willing to ship it all here. I need an alternative..

As far as the C10/12/13 Flavors of Colt go... Seemingly the rear suspension is exactly the same as the Mitsubishi Precis/Hyundai Excel X1 and the Hyundai Scoupe including the turbo model. The REAR strut part numbers are the same for the Colt, Precis/Excel and Scoupe, but the front springs are not between the Scoupe and Excel. For the Colt there is no listing/part #'s for any replacement springs. Awkward right? Would it be due to higher spring rates? I'm not sure.

Then for the front suspension, the top strut pillowball mount for the Precis/Excel has 4 studs, the Scoupe having the same [sometimes just 2], whereas the Colt has no strut pillowball mount at all. No studs to go through or holes for them on the strut tower. The strut rod goes through the spring, right up in the strut tower, tighten the strut nut, and there you go its straight to the car. So theoretically, I could use the front struts for an Precis/Excel/Scoupe. They look the same as the Colt's, they have the same mounting holes. I could bolt them to the body in the same fashion the Colt intended it to be. But here's the kicker, the struts between the C10 Colt and the Excel/Scoupe are as follows:

1988 Colt:
Extended Length: 16.39 In.
Collapsed Length: 9.84 In.
Stroke: 6.54 In.

1989/90+Excel/ Scoupe:
Extended Length: 16.32 In.
Collapsed Length: 9.67 In.
Stroke: 6.65 In.

I don't see the huge difference and if they will bolt right up I should be golden. In my case, Koni makes Koni Special struts for the Hyundai Scoupe and I can get them. The fronts are adjustable cartridge inserts, and the rears are adjustable direct fits. I don't see much of an issue trying these out.. Since the fronts are cartridges it should actually have no issue bolting up because they insert and it bolts up at the top. Now would anyone see a problem with trying this out on the C10 Colt?

Also, I found sport springs, specifically from BG, for the Excel and the Scoupe, although they don't provide the spring rates or anything. I question BG's knowledge of interchangeability because they do not show the sport springs being able to fit the Mitsubishi Precis. Its the same car, so you would think it fits. If I were to get the ones from the Scoupe with the Koni Special struts and try them out, it should technically just drop my Colt 1.5 inches.

I could also go the cheaper route and just try the BG springs for the Excel [or The Scoupe] on my Colt. I'm also rolling my rear 1/4 panel fenders anyway because they are straight and not curved if and when I do try all of this.. So no need to worry about that.

I really need some serious input here on this, and I'm sure I'm going to be one of the only ones crazy enough to give this all a shot. And well one of the only ones that even want a suspension setup on a C10. Any info's appreciated, whether big or small.

_________________
-1988 Dodge Colt Hatchback - G15b w/ KM200
-1998 Neon R/T Coupe Hahn Stage II
-2014 Subaru BRZ Limited


Last edited by Ninjaneonturtle on Tue Oct 06, 2009 9:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 06, 2009 7:45 am 
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Spends Too Much Time Under The Hood

Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2007 1:25 pm
Posts: 204
Location: Charlotte, NC
I just wanted to say that I am very glad that you are doing this research! I'd like to do a suspension upgrade to my c13 too but had no idea where to begin. I am pretty sure anything you come up with is better than the stock setup on this car.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 06, 2009 9:00 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 9:43 pm
Posts: 215
Location: Cape May Court House, NJ
Thanks for the support! I also found out the in Malaysia and other countries, that the Proton Saga [Colt Sedan] has lowering springs, sport suspension and coilovers.

If you wiki "Proton Saga" you'll find that since the the borrowed second gen 85-88 body style Colt [Proton Saga], marked the beginning of Malaysia's automotive industry. It was produced in the same bodystyle from 1985-2008. The Saga had a facelift in 2003-2008, which is mostly just upgraded interior and bodywork with the same underpinnings. That's a crapload of colts... It was also sold in the UK as the Proton MPI. Either way look it up for yourself.. its a great read.

Proton Saga owners actually convert their cars aesthetically into Mitsubishi Colts/Lancer Fiores. Makes it interesting of how available parts are in other countries.. lol. It sucks...

_________________
-1988 Dodge Colt Hatchback - G15b w/ KM200
-1998 Neon R/T Coupe Hahn Stage II
-2014 Subaru BRZ Limited


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 06, 2009 9:22 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 9:43 pm
Posts: 215
Location: Cape May Court House, NJ
I've also been studying the difference between the 1st/2nd gen CSM and the 3rd gen and it just seems like the 3rd gen is the same underpinnings and main structure of unibody as a 1st/2nd gen. My engine bay is honestly the same in mounts and structure as a 3rd gen CSM.. Everything is in the same spot. Brake booster, VIN plate, its all identical..

I'm almost wondering if I can swap out my whole rear subframe for a 3rd gen's because the underbody is so alike, I would just have to find a way to mount it.. For the rear, if that's the case and they're similar, I could go straight for AWD like a 3rd gen can.... :snakeman:

Even the front strut towers can most likely be modified to accept 3rd gen struts very easily.. If that's the case, I could use DSM struts also.

They all are on the C platform if I'm not mistaken, which technically can mean all/most of the parts can work. If anyone's tried interchanging anything between the platforms, I'd like to know the success rate of it.

Lol.. This seems like an I'm thinking out loud thread.. But that's okay I suppose.. Someone chime in when they feel the need to.. maybe I don't have to drive myself crazy thinking about this too much.

_________________
-1988 Dodge Colt Hatchback - G15b w/ KM200
-1998 Neon R/T Coupe Hahn Stage II
-2014 Subaru BRZ Limited


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 10:52 pm 
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Spends Too Much Time Under The Hood

Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:27 pm
Posts: 328
Location: Las Vegas
I am very intrested in any suspension info out there, and will be doing a lot of work to upgrade it, including a whole new rear end. Keep up the work and reserch


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2009 6:00 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 9:43 pm
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Location: Cape May Court House, NJ
After a bunch of looking up part numbers again and searching. AND also buying supposedly wrong parts. I've come to a few conclusions.

My car is a 1988 Colt. Its a 2nd gen. They switched mid model year 1988 to the 3rd gen CSM. So when I order parts at a store or anything for a 1988 model year CSM, they give me parts for a 3rd gen. because of the model switch that year to the C50. Crazy isn't it? That's how the 1988 colt is portrayed in everyone's systems. What's the same and what's interchangeable/upgradable? Lets find out..

So I did some research. I had ordered axles, and brake rotors, calipers, and pads. The brakes are almost the same. Calipers are slightly updated between second and third gen, but granted, the auto store gave me 3rd gen CSM calipers, and I put them on my car unknowingly. I ordered axles for a manual transmission. Those fit right on. I didn't find out that these parts were for a 3rd gen until after I had installed them. Some part numbers interchange, some don't. Although the parts look identical.

As for brakes, since I found out too late, 1st/2nd gen CSMers can do the Elantra brake upgrades, and also the Elantra rotor/1g DSM caliper/bracket/pads brake upgrade. I'm planning ont he Elantra/1g upgrade when I need brakes down the line.

The steering knuckle on a C10 and a C50 are identical. the hub, bearings, calipers and rotors interchange. It also leads me to believe that the 3rd gen struts will fit also. The stroke of the strut is longer if I recall. The lower control arms are updated on the 3rd gen and will not work on a 2nd gen. I also know for a fact that the rear suspension between C10 and C50 wouldn't interchange without major modification to the rear strut mounts/towers. A bunch of this stuff leads me to believe that the hydraulic clutch pedals and system is interchangeable also. Will keep an update on that.

I just need to compare the two cars suspension for suspension, underside for underside to see what fits and works and what doesn't. I don't have a 3rd gen colt in my vicinity to even go look so I'm limited to photos for now.

_________________
-1988 Dodge Colt Hatchback - G15b w/ KM200
-1998 Neon R/T Coupe Hahn Stage II
-2014 Subaru BRZ Limited


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2009 7:57 pm 
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Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2006 3:03 pm
Posts: 1134
Location: Calgary, AB, Canada
What pictures do you need. I have a 3g sedan in my garage.

_________________
05 wrx wagon
99 Benz ML 320
91 eagle summit swapped - 6/4 bolt combo
94 Audi s4 - sold
88 Eagle Vista Turbo LX sedan, RIP


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 12:52 am 
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Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 9:43 pm
Posts: 215
Location: Cape May Court House, NJ
Quote:
What pictures do you need. I have a 3g sedan in my garage.
Within the next week I'll take some hi resolution pics and post them, all I would need is those angles, but on your 91 sedan. Unless you're willing to snap some and compare 2nd/3rd gens since you have both. I just hope the 3g hatch and sedan suspensions are the same.. Should be though. I'd be taking a lot of photos, mainly of the brakes, behind on the steering knuckle, lower control arms/swaybars, front and rear strut mounting points underneath the top and bottom, subframe/crossmembers, engine/tranny mounts, engine bay shots. I would also like to just see if there's any Mitsubishi part numbers stamped on the suspension parts to compare them. I mean they are both "C" platforms so they have to be similar unibody and just "updated" between gens.

You have both gens though, so do you see similarities between the two?

_________________
-1988 Dodge Colt Hatchback - G15b w/ KM200
-1998 Neon R/T Coupe Hahn Stage II
-2014 Subaru BRZ Limited


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 20, 2009 10:55 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 9:43 pm
Posts: 215
Location: Cape May Court House, NJ
Also just found out a way to have bolt on lower ball joints! and nice new control arms. Simple actually. The Hyundai Excel and Scoupe have the same lower control arms as a C10, but with bolt on ball joints. Which makes servicing them so much easier. So get a set at the local junk yard, or you can get them brand new at the autostore, including ball joints.

Also with going on the hunt for some more Scoupe info, the Scoupe has the same suspension as a C10 Colt. Check out these pics:

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d56/j ... 230002.jpg
http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d56/j ... 230004.jpg
http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d56/j ... 230003.jpg

See the Koni struts on there? Most likely will fit on a C10 no problem. Also found out that the Scoupe turbo from 1993-1995 has stiffer springs and struts, many enthusiasts claim the suspension is rock hard. :D So in theory anything aftermarket suspension wise for a Scoupe would work on a C10

Low and behold I think I've had a great solution to the C10's suspension needs without having to try and use the C50's parts.

Maybe the front brakes are swappable also. Vented disks, bolt right on with the brackets and calipers? Seems to be, but I'm hitting the sack. 12 hour work day tomorrow..

_________________
-1988 Dodge Colt Hatchback - G15b w/ KM200
-1998 Neon R/T Coupe Hahn Stage II
-2014 Subaru BRZ Limited


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:12 am 
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Spends Too Much Time Under The Hood

Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2007 1:25 pm
Posts: 204
Location: Charlotte, NC
What year in particular for the Hyundai Excel and Scoupe's lower ball joints and control arms? I need to replace mine, so this might be what I need. Thank you and keep up the great work!!!

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 21, 2009 8:39 am 
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Location: Cape May Court House, NJ
Quote:
What year in particular for the Hyundai Excel and Scoupe's lower ball joints and control arms? I need to replace mine, so this might be what I need. Thank you and keep up the great work!!!

_______________________

If you go to autozone they have them for a 1991 excel. Both control arms and ball joints are listed for the excel only. The scoupe they don't list the control arms for. Ball joints are the same part number. I haven't tried all the years yet, only 88, 91, 92 excel, and 92, 93 scoupe as that's when the bodystyle was freshened up for the scoupe.

It gets me too that they have replacement coil springs listed for the excel when they don't list them for the colt and scoupe. But the application guide applys the colt. Lol

Edit: Oh yeah forgot that the Scoupe has "Lotus tuned" suspension.. that's why... :wink:

_________________
-1988 Dodge Colt Hatchback - G15b w/ KM200
-1998 Neon R/T Coupe Hahn Stage II
-2014 Subaru BRZ Limited


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 25, 2010 9:34 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 9:43 pm
Posts: 215
Location: Cape May Court House, NJ
so on a small update, I'm going to try to get a hold of some scoupe springs and swapping them for mine.

_________________
-1988 Dodge Colt Hatchback - G15b w/ KM200
-1998 Neon R/T Coupe Hahn Stage II
-2014 Subaru BRZ Limited


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 4:52 pm 
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Spends Too Much Time Under The Hood
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Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 9:43 pm
Posts: 215
Location: Cape May Court House, NJ
Reviving this technical discussion with myself from the dead. I finally accidentally ordered a set of Scoupe springs very cheaply. Thank you Chrome for crashing and restoring the page as Ordered.

I'll be posting updates on here as well. Freshening up my entire suspension on a budget. Scored some KYB shocks and struts, new strut bearing mounts and making new bushings for the front control arms.

_________________
-1988 Dodge Colt Hatchback - G15b w/ KM200
-1998 Neon R/T Coupe Hahn Stage II
-2014 Subaru BRZ Limited


Last edited by Ninjaneonturtle on Tue Dec 02, 2014 9:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 9:19 pm 
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CSM Junkie

Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 9:52 pm
Posts: 589
Location: miami
hello guys i have a set of hyundai scoupe Koni rear struts on my C-10 for few years now, they are adjustable and they fit perfect

_________________
1987 C10 mitsu mirage 2.0 turbo (mean sleeper) in rerstoration process


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 9:23 pm 
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Spends Too Much Time Under The Hood
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Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 9:43 pm
Posts: 215
Location: Cape May Court House, NJ
Quote:
hello guys i have a set of hyundai scoupe Koni rear struts on my C-10 for few years now, they are adjustable and they fit perfect
I found those for sale recently, but I don't have the cash right now for Scoupe Koni rear shocks! Thanks for the confirmation on fitment.

_________________
-1988 Dodge Colt Hatchback - G15b w/ KM200
-1998 Neon R/T Coupe Hahn Stage II
-2014 Subaru BRZ Limited


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